tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post6818198072643584309..comments2023-09-24T08:04:06.909-04:00Comments on FSK's Guide to Reality: Stefan Molyneux is a Murderer!FSKhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11903396202330950362noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-91124508760364267212011-06-08T08:48:54.737-04:002011-06-08T08:48:54.737-04:00http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cac...http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:pIec7NE4-5kJ:www.wired.com/medtech/drugs/magazine/17-09/ff_placebo_effect?currentPage%3DallSpiritsplicehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17321166225861350640noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-27380099784407035172011-06-08T08:43:50.717-04:002011-06-08T08:43:50.717-04:00http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,199...http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1992988,00.htmlSpiritsplicehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17321166225861350640noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-66827108076924061672011-06-08T08:41:45.507-04:002011-06-08T08:41:45.507-04:00http://www.newsweek.com/2010/01/28/the-depressing-...http://www.newsweek.com/2010/01/28/the-depressing-news-about-antidepressants.htmlSpiritsplicehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17321166225861350640noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-29126990238825120352010-05-23T03:32:47.097-04:002010-05-23T03:32:47.097-04:00I don't like Molyneux, but c'mon, psychiat...I don't like Molyneux, but c'mon, psychiatry isn't perfect, but it's not a fraud. You know all on your own you're not a normal person, you've done things that got you institutionalized, things we "normal" people don't do. Psychiatry may not be accurate, but it doesn't go out hunting for people, or else you can't explain the fact I know nobody who's been institutionalized. <br /><br />We're not talking about ADHD, MD or autism, where many people are misdiagnosed and it's arguable how common the symptoms are, or what causes it, psychiatrists just don't get as many clients and customers as pharma does. On that point, without trusting psychiatry, I'd not consider it a money scheme, but rather a serious discipline that addresses serious problems (even if they're doing it wrong, the problems exist).Kylehttp://twitter.com/hellzballernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-61335576755661267942009-12-29T00:17:28.707-05:002009-12-29T00:17:28.707-05:00Hi, I also was a victim of being forced to take &q...Hi, I also was a victim of being forced to take "anti-psychotic" drugs, psychiatry is indeed evil. I have slowly been able to ween myself off them over the last few years, but I will never forget the nasty side-effects. Freeing oneself from the shackles of psychiatry and their evil drugs makes it clear what an evil system it is, when there are so many people in its grips, still taking these horrible drugs.<br />cheers,<br />Jamie<br /><br />ps. you can email me jmorken@shaw.caAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-90240753622563600542009-10-23T17:58:40.899-04:002009-10-23T17:58:40.899-04:00Well, then please tell me, Mr. Stefan Molyneux (wh...Well, then please tell me, Mr. Stefan Molyneux (whose wife, and therefore him, have a vested interest in the growth of this field) how did all of those people get along 100 years ago? How did our society become so enamored with all of these drugs, mostly invented in the last 20 years? Please, the field of psychiatry is nothing more than a bunch of useless quacks trying to be important.Billnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-14258082025871686162009-10-20T19:32:37.255-04:002009-10-20T19:32:37.255-04:00I really hope you continue updating this post. Yo...I really hope you continue updating this post. You covered a lot of ground and most of the people who bothered to comment did not read your post all the way through. I believe this is a key reason why people do not agree with you. They are not looking at the evidence.<br /><br />Just wanted to add...I noticed you covered the argument against the status quo (#3 in my comment above) and are already aware that while the burden of proof is on the other party...the burden of changing the status quo is unfortunately not.Chronohttp://chronosaidit.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-74293976827330063282009-10-20T19:06:41.166-04:002009-10-20T19:06:41.166-04:00A couple of things.
1) I have not read one 'I ...A couple of things.<br />1) I have not read one 'I agree with Stef' post that <b>disagreed</b> with FSK for anything more than a flimsy (sample size) reason. FSK actually gave more than just that reason for coming to the conclusions he discussed.<br />2) FSK, you <b><i>are very hostile</i></b> to Stefan's position. I want to make this clear as I remember commenting on your post on investing your IRA in GLD or SLV, I believe, and you commented back with 'why are you so hostile' when I clearly was not. For examples of a hostile post, read your comments about Stefan above. For a non-hostile example, read my post and very clear and rational questioning of your position on GLD.<br />3) This is a very good post. The burden of proof concept is completely irrelevant. The relevant idea here is power. Just like when dealing with the state, if you are accused of a crime, you are guilty until proven innocent, since, if you do nto fight the charges, you will be punished, thus the null hypothesis or the status quo is that you are guilty, <b>until you prove yourself innocent</b>. This issue is no different. You must prove that the psycho-drug-industrial-complex is a harmful machine, because if you do not, Stef will not change his view, the supporting 'splinters' above will keep bleating that they agree with him, and the machine will keep grinding people up as it has in the past. The only way to change that is to prove it. Or hope for a miracle. I hope you appreciate this point of view. I believe it is the correct one.Chronohttp://chronosaidit.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-50505577163855445442009-10-11T22:05:19.654-04:002009-10-11T22:05:19.654-04:00Interestingly Dr Nash (he won the Economics Nobel ...Interestingly Dr Nash (he won the Economics Nobel prize) stopped taking his drugs totally.<br /><br />Watch the movie below. The relevant part starts at around 21 minutes.<br /><br />http://nobelprize.org/mediaplayer/index.php?id=429<br /><br />There was a movie about his life. (A Beautiful Mind). The producer of the movie decided not to tell the truth about Dr Nash stopping taking his medicines and decided instead to say Dr Nash moved to a more modern drug on the grounds that it is dangerous to suggest to people they can stop taking drugs for mental illnesses!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-58862938102635371502009-10-10T17:00:41.996-04:002009-10-10T17:00:41.996-04:00I found this post to be confusing and I have no id...I found this post to be confusing and I have no idea why you are so angry at Molyneaux.<br /><br />He certainly showed his willingness and openness to your premise when he asked to see any studies you may know about. It's not his fault you had no answer to his query about studies.<br /><br />What else did you want him to do at that point? Once you told your personal experience and had no studies to link to then the discussion obviously ends there.<br /><br />It doesn't mean either of you are bad guys or anything.<br /><br />The only thing you can possibly convince anyone of is that you had a bad experience with psychiatric drugs. That says nothing in general about the usefulness or non usefulness of drugs in general. However, I think its good to tell others about your experience in the hope that it helps others if they ever get to a place where they need to make decisions about such things.<br /><br />You also attributed some quotes directly to him but I cannot find them. Are these real quotes or did you just put them in quotes as an extrapolation of your opinion of what he thinks?<br /><br />By the way, I stay far away from drugs as I can and am very careful about medications of all sorts. I am sorry you went through all you did.Debbie H.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02209691050549648880noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-73089528665367771132009-10-07T19:25:08.771-04:002009-10-07T19:25:08.771-04:00I wouldn't entirely agree with you about gener...I wouldn't entirely agree with you about generalizing all psychiatrists for much of the same reasons already pointed out by other commentators, albeit I do think people shouldn't be so quick to trust their psychiatrists and therapists for many of the reasons you pointed out (like biases).<br /><br />But I would say that I was always vary of a "see a therapist" advice given by Stef for similar reasons as you. I don't expect them to understand my ideas regarding the state, family and coercion in general. Instead I fear that much of their advice will come from a context and perspective that I would reject. I simply don't trust them enough to open myself up to them. <br /><br />In fact, I'd rather completely voluntarily and with full awareness, have a talk with Molyneux about some issue than with a typical therapist. I know he's not a "professional" therapist and I would take his advice with a grain of salt (that is think it through myself), but when it comes to personal issues it's really ideas, methods and perspectives I'm after and that can be given by almost any experienced free thinker, including Stef.<br /><br />I would classify such a talk closer to a helpful discussion with a friend than a therapy session with some therapist whose authority I'm supposed to just assume based on his certificates..memenodehttp://doubleplushuman.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-81921502575153213042009-10-07T08:18:51.125-04:002009-10-07T08:18:51.125-04:00Maybe drugs for mental illness are wrong some of t...Maybe drugs for mental illness are wrong some of the time and right for some people.<br /><br />I suspect in FSK's case they were wrong. As he said he was well for many years before. So what changed? Unless a doctor can say what changed, he/she can't say if drugs are appropriate?<br /><br />I did hear that long-term medicines don't actually make you healthier i.e. they will just make you more susceptible for a different form of illness.<br /><br />Good food and exercise is what people need.<br /><br />A friend of mine once said that he had to work out when to leave certain jobs - it was a balance of getting money in versus the loss of his mental health due to idiot bosses, bad work situations etc. If he got the balance wrong he would get upset for days afterwards.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-60263113766391305342009-10-06T19:55:51.601-04:002009-10-06T19:55:51.601-04:00Great post FSK!
This gave me a good idea. You men...Great post FSK! <br />This gave me a good idea. You mentioned the idea of a free-market experiment. Its true you could not do it "for real" because of the tax implications. But you could do some sort of "laboratory" experiment similar to the famous prison experiment. You could take 2 groups of individuals and place them in identical enviroments and give them access to various resources/raw materials (uncut logs for fuel, non-potable water, raw foods, domestic animals etc...) and some sort of fake currency like monopoly money. I'd have to think about the initial division of the resources to have a starting point but the idea would be for the participants to survive via trade like they would normally. <br />One group would operate using free market principles without a government and the other with a taxation based economy with a government.<br />The groups could be measured in terms of general standard of living, quantity of goods produced etc...<br />Maybe mises university could sponsor the experiment! haha!theftthroughinflationhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04033030175673408941noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-77692472826180347222009-10-06T16:38:36.782-04:002009-10-06T16:38:36.782-04:00Stefan is a murderer because he doesn't think ...Stefan is a murderer because he doesn't think all psychiatrists are out to get people? <br /><br />Stef's wife is a state licensed psychologist, and he's been in therapy before (I don't know if it was with drugs). I'm sure it will be tough to convince him that industry is all about killing people when I'm sure he sees his wife helping people on a daily basis. <br /><br />Drugs aren't always (maybe even rarely) the answer, as they generally are used to mask underlying symptoms that need to be treated with some sort of talk therapy. But I know someone who would be regarded as clinically insane (paranoid/schizophrenia) who does not take meds, and she should be on meds, because she literally cannot process reality (and a single conversation with her would convince you of this). I hardly think using drug therapy to help her actually process reality correctly (so at least she isn't a harm to herself and others) is a step in the right direction, far from murder.<br /><br />And I'm sorry, but a your individual testimony regarding the industry isn't going to convince anyone that it's as terrible as you say it is. I can produce someone who's life is orders of magnitude better seeing a psychiatrist (and taking meds). It's like someone trying to convince me their personal deity exists because of some random experience they had. Great for them, but not convincing. How does your theory explain the people who are actually helped by the industry? (And saying 'they aren't actually helped!' isn't acceptable).<br /><br />(And I'm not a pro state troll, nor am I a murderer.)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-28688862955314041532009-10-06T14:38:27.190-04:002009-10-06T14:38:27.190-04:00Sorry, I've read the thread and I'm siding...Sorry, I've read the thread and I'm siding with Stef.<br /><br />You are basing your conclusion, as you yourself say, on a sample of 1. That's illogical and unscientific.<br /><br />Present evidence they ar e harmful, evidence that can be duplicated by others, and you'll have a case.<br /><br />I've never had an issue with anti-depressants. I was on them for 5 years, with no issues or addictions and have been free of them for 8 years now.<br /><br />Does my sample size of 1 now disprove yours? By your logic it does.Mikehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06941875334878452635noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-5192083542326496642009-10-06T14:38:21.340-04:002009-10-06T14:38:21.340-04:00This is why I like the liberty movement. It natur...This is why I like the liberty movement. It naturally and necessarily splinters. It's not a bad thing. It may seem counterproductive on the surface, but it is the way it should be.Anthonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05262963620606499940noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2182962435875556601.post-74208899069589883902009-10-06T14:18:03.062-04:002009-10-06T14:18:03.062-04:00"Stefan Molyneux said "FSK has the burde..."Stefan Molyneux said "FSK has the burden of proof, that psychiatric drugs are harmful." This is exactly the same logical mistake that Stefan Molyneux accuses statists of making!"<br /><br />+10!<br /><br />"Bayesian reasoning"<br /><br />Nice! I like that concept.<br /><br />Have you considered moving to New Hampshire? You may find a saner environment up there.George Donnellyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16984579502979682678noreply@blogger.com